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John de Ruiter Podcast 490

John de Ruiter Podcast 490

A Matrix of Meaning: Building a Real Relationship

When: March 9, 2013 @ 7:00pm
The great, unseen potential of real relationship is opened up in this conversation. Exquisite, with no need of understanding, here is how two people can explore and be together in depths of meaning beyond themselves.
“The two of you building a relationship based on what is known within and unseen, is the two of you building a relationship that is greater than your selves.”
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Podcast Transcript

A Matrix of Meaning: Building a Real Relationship

Q: You were talking about man and woman, that the woman was giving and the man was receiving. What does a man do with the love that he receives, and does the woman just keep on giving or is there something that happens after that?

John: There’s meeting from within the deeper levels, levels within that have nothing to do with the self. Meeting from within the deeper levels enables travel. Travelling in each other. You spend your day doing things and going places in your life. It’s all outside of your self. In a real relationship where there are no filters and boundaries, what there is is meaning meeting meaning moving together as one, in each other and through all of the deeper levels. The enjoyment of doing things outside of your self in your day exists because you have that, within. Outside of your self is everything seen and the deeper levels, within, is everything unseen. The meaning, the depth of meaning in your day exchanging with what is in your environment is dependent on the depths, within, that you’re really coming from.

A real relationship offers the exploration of that, the exploration of those depths; depths of meaning from within which you meet that are, from the perspective of your self, unseen.

Q: And they become seen through the other?

John: If you are really meeting, they are first known, and as you develop as meaning aware in what is known, the unseen that is known becomes seen. You get to know the inward landscapes, knowing how to move within together in all of the deeper levels.

Q: Is there a particular way of doing that?

John: By relating as awareness directly to the deeper levels. Anything deeper, within, that you’ve awakened to that is more than what your self is, relate to that together. In relating to that together you’ll be moving in that together, building a relationship, building ways of relating that are based on what is unseen. It becomes seen in the relating when that deeper relating means more to each of you than your selves, than your selves together, making your selves a means of expression, expressing everything that is known, within: deeper streams of being, deeper streams of relating at first almost not known. At first what you’re knowing, within, is a subtlety, a subtlety of being, delicacies of being, offering almost nothing to your self. You’re not in it for reward. As awareness, you’re in it for the truth of it.

Q: So when there’s an awareness of that truth inside of me, it’s allowing it to be expressed and to be giving it in the relationship?

John: Yes. The expression of it is in the two of you meeting.

Q: It feels to me that it would be automatically given.

John: Anything that you give that is unseen, within, but known is going to make your self feel vulnerable. You’ll be moving in what is more than what your self is, more than what your self is used to. You’ll be giving what is more than what your self is. The expression of that through your self exposes, in your experience, that your self is less than what you are and than what you’re giving.

Being the exquisite is uncomfortable in your self. As soon as the feeling of that discomfort matters, you’ll move out of the exquisite and you’ll move into coping in your self. As soon as you’re coping in your self, you’ll compensate. You’ll do something in your self to compensate for the discomfort. You’ll move through a filter and a boundary; moving filters and boundaries instead of you, meaning, moving meaning.

As soon as the meeting, within, isn’t direct through the deeper levels, compensation is being made in the self. It’s the form that you have and the form that you use to put together a filter and a boundary so that you can make adjustments in your experience, as awareness – adjusting for the discomfort. Then it is a filter and a boundary meeting a filter and a boundary.

Q: Are you talking about the filter and the boundary in him?

John: And in you. In a relationship it’s easier to open the deeper levels of your body. Also in a relationship it’s easier to close the deeper levels of your body. Everything is magnified because the potential of two together is greater.

Q: When you talk about the deeper levels of the body, are you talking about physical, deeper physical levels?

John: Every deeper level in you, every unseen deeper level, is also in your body, and it is physical. The level you’re most accustomed to in your body is the level of your self in your body. When you take something personally or want something personally, that registers in your nervous system. You experience it in your body. In that way your self is experienced as being real. It’s actual in your body.

The deeper levels in you are meant to be actualized in your body. You’re able to make them real in your body. You’re able to realize them in the physical. As it’s realized in the physical, your nervous system changes. Your nervous system becomes available to what is deeper within, instead of your nervous system being available to your self and to what you experience in your body as a self.

You know that there are deeper levels, within. Even as they are unknown to you, you know they’re there. As you relate to what you’re knowing, even though you’re not understanding what you’re relating to, you know the truth of what you’re relating to. You’re able, as awareness, to relate directly to what you know within. That direct relating awakens the level that pertains to the truth of what you’re relating to, making that knowing within no longer unseen, but known and seen, known and physical.

Q: How I’m feeling in my body now, it’s just a sensation and it’s a different awareness of how my body feels, but I don’t understand it.

John: You can’t understand it. You can’t understand it until you develop a self that is of the same level as the deeper levels, within. You need to develop and build a greater self and a higher self for you to be able to understand in your self the meaning of the deeper levels, within.

You don’t need to understand them for you to be in them. You can be in them by relating directly to what you’re knowing, within. You’re in them through absorption. As soon as you have knowledge within of what is deeper, that you surrender to being absorbed by what you’re knowing, that takes you in. You don’t need to understand what you’re entering, within. It’s enough to know the truth of it. What you’re coming into is a level of meaning that’s deeper than anything that you’ve understood in your self, and it’s home to you. It is what you are in your body for and it is what you are in relationship for.

Q: I don’t have a memory of having ever felt like that, even as a child.

John: Then you didn’t have enough of a self to register it so that you could remember it. Hold a baby. Be present with a baby, and you know that you can’t use your self to be with that baby. The baby is coming from levels, within, that you can’t understand in your self and you don’t need your self for the two of you to meet.

Such meeting means more to you than how you are able to meet with someone in your self. In your self there’s form within which you can meet; you can use that form to meet and there isn’t the depth of meaning. The depth of meaning in meeting is deeper, within, than what your self is. Of that, through directly relating to that, you’re able to build a new self. You’re able to build a self that is the same as all of the deeper levels within, making all of you and your forms of the same.

The sustaining of oneness, within, is in you giving it form. If you’re not giving it form, you’re not sustaining it.

The two of you building a relationship based on what is known within and unseen is the two of you building a relationship that is greater than your selves; the two of you building greater selves. You’re not using what is understood in doing that. You’re using what is known and unseen. The first of the building is through your relating, relating directly to what you’re knowing. That becomes building material in your self, as the meaning of it means more to you than your self. Your self becomes a matrix of meaning instead of a matrix of patterning.

Q: It seems to me that it’s not necessary to talk to each other. It may come up, but we can just be together as you and me, now.

John: And you can express it physically. The level that you’re coming from is the level that will be teaching your own nervous system. In that way, you begin to use your nervous system, as meaning, to find him – not his self: him.

Q: Using my nervous system in meaning to find him?

John: When you’re moving as meaning, because you’re relating to what you’re knowing, within, and what you’re knowing is unseen, through the directness of your relating to knowing you’re able to express the meaning of that through your body to him. As you’re coming from any deeper level, within, that changes for you what your body is, giving you ability through the physical for you as meaning aware to reach him, to find him. You’re able through your body to communicate, not in ways that you understand but in ways that you know. You’re able to make unseen reality, within, real to him.

Neither one of you will be understanding. Both of you will be knowing, knowing meaning, meaning that is foreign to your selves and home to both of you. You’ll be the mystery of meaning moving into him and finding him, grounding him directly in what he knows and doesn’t understand. Like what a baby does to you. You’re able to be that to him without him having to be that to you or with you. You’re able to give what is unseen.

Love what you know, within, that you can’t see, to him. It doesn’t matter what he does with that. What you are is unstoppable. Your relating isn’t to your self, to him. It is to what you know, within, to him.

Q: When I have the image of a baby, it’s genderless and yet there are women and there are men. I shouldn’t be concerned about that?

John: Like a baby. When you meet a baby and you’re relating not to your self but to knowing, as soon as you meet, the baby takes you. It takes you straight into the deeper levels, within. The baby takes you in because the baby doesn’t relate to anything else, yet. When you’re relating not to your self but to knowing, you relate to what the baby takes you into.

You’re able to be that in relationship: being together with what you know, within, meaning more to you than your self or his.

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