JdR Podcast 376

A Deeper Perspective on COVID-19: From Fear to Inner Wellbeing

In these days of social distancing and self-isolation, John continues to meet our questions from an online platform. What does he mean by “truth is going viral?” Here are three dialogues opening different perspectives on this worldwide shock event, and revealing the opportunity for each one of us to meet and respond to it from a deeper truth within.

"The invitation that’s present within this extreme worldwide event is to relate to something that’s other than what affects our selves: other than fear, other than hope, other than survival. There’s the invitation to quietly realize, within, in a way that’s new, and it stands on its own."

—John de Ruiter

This dialogue also appeared on VOD-000

Podcast Transcript

With John de Ruiter from the March 15, 2020, Interactive Live Stream

Q1: I just really wanted to ask you, John, if you would take us into, through you, into what’s happening around the world. You said “truth is going viral” and I would just love to hear anything that you could say about the times that we find our selves in.

John: Well, there’s the horizontal level of this worldwide shock event of the C19 virus, all that that is affecting on so many different levels, and then there is the vertical level. It intersects with the horizontal, but it isn’t about the horizontal. So the vertical level has a groundedness, a stability, a constancy that has nothing to do with any event, and staying connected where the two meet, so that it’s the vertical knowledge of a depth knowledge within that governs our sense of wellbeing and stability concerning anything horizontal, whether it’s positive or negative.

Q1: When a shock happens like this, does that activate something at the points where the horizontal and the vertical connect?

John: If you’re conscious at that particular point where the two meet, then the vertical radiates through the horizontal which brings you from a depth within to do whatever you need to do.

Q1: So for us in our knowledge of you and our response to what you mean to us, how does that move in what you’re saying of the horizontal and the vertical? Because I couldn’t say that I’m conscious of that point of intersection, but I feel like I have consciousness moving somehow, or something like that.

John: The simplicity of that is in a depth okayness, an inner quietude concerning anything within the horizontal. As soon as you’re removed from the vertical then you’ll be subject to emotional stability or lack of emotional stability.

Q1: When there is some measure of restedness does the horizontal have layers or levels to it?

John: Yes, immediately all of the levels of the self: the mind, the emotions, the will, feeling.

Q1: Is there more for us to do than be in that depth okayness? Is there more, or does that depend on each one?

John: It’s important to not use that okayness to balance any feeling or thought concerning what’s taking place in this whole worldwide event of the virus. As soon as the vertical is being used to stabilize the horizontal, then that’s a use of the horizontal accessing the vertical for the sake of the horizontal, whereas the vertical is first completely on its own.

So if you’re affected by something in the horizontal, that would be your cue to be vertical: not for the sake of the horizontal, but because it reminds you what matters more than your experience, what matters more than your life, what goes deeper than everything, and then being that depth of verticality, coming from what’s deeper than your self and being that in all of the horizontal, which is a perspective shift.

Q1: A few days ago I had just had this sense that – it was like a seeing – I felt like it was the virus. I felt like I was seeing that over the whole planet. I don’t know if that’s what it was, but it was one of those kind of drop-in glimpses that doesn’t seem like it’s connected to anything familiar in my self. I have no real understanding about this but it was such a surprise and had so much form to it within my own body. Can you say something to that?

John: Everything in the horizontal is dependent on the vertical. The horizontal doesn’t exist on its own. The deep does exist on its own. To be in real relationship with anything such as the virus is to be in connection to that through the deep, within, deeper than thought and feeling, deeper than will or emotion. In that way our selves are first factored out of what’s going on, whereas our tendency is to bring our selves in first in what’s going on, because it’s in our selves that we’re affected.

Where you’re connected to a shock event such as what the world is in right now from what is deeper than thought or feeling, will or emotion, it puts you on a level of experience in what’s going on that’s overlaying this whole world and affecting everyone, but from a perspective and a direct experience that has nothing to do with our selves. So it puts us in a much deeper level of what the virus is, which first, then, in that level, has nothing to do with, really, the virus or us.

On a level of all things being connected and everything affecting everything, a virus can’t even be understood as a virus. We have that understanding, our understanding of a virus based on our experience of it, how it affects our selves, how it affects our bodies. But without that effect, what’s taking place in deeper levels within a virus is completely different from anything that we can even relate to in our selves, just like the deeper levels of time change so much that time isn’t even recognizable as time.

Q1: When something so shared like this, and has so much attention around it all across the world, does that change the form of the thing, in this case the virus? Does that actually interact with the deeper levels of that form?

John: Yes. Consciousness is connected on every level, so yes, there’s a surface effect and there’s also a deeper level effect that has first nothing to do with the surface effect.

Q1: As this moves through, is it that we do the things like you’re saying in the horizontal that make sense to do, and then we open in the vertical? That opportunity, how is that more?

John: Everything that takes place in your experience is going to feed your orientation as awareness, so if you’re oriented to the horizontal, it’s the horizontal in your experience that is going to flare up. If you’re oriented to the vertical, anything that takes place in the horizontal opens you up immediately into the deep. It’s the deep in you that radiates instead of an emotional, mental experience.

It isn’t going to be the same for everyone: it’s all dependent on what each is oriented to regardless of what they think, what they believe. If you’re oriented to the truth within, then immediately there’s going to be an opening, an opening deeper within that moves up into your experience that may not affect you in your experience in a way that makes sense to you, because it’s the deep within that’s radiating in your surface experience. So you can have experiences that don’t make sense, or having a deeper sense that doesn’t have a practical application.

What this does offer is that there is a depth perspective that’s emerging in your self that isn’t first measured in an intellectual way or in a cognitive way. It measures in a depth radiation that’s present in your experience. So it’s openness going out into your experience, into the horizontal, affecting your seeing in your life even though that may not first, directly, have practical results. So what it first reveals to you is a depth knowledge that is what you are instead of your experience being what you are.

Q1: As I’m resonating with what you’re saying, it feels like it’s touching a part of my mind, like deep mind. I don’t have any awareness really, there, but it feels that there is maybe something like warmth or some kind of life in the deep mind, like if the deep mind was like deep space, and there was like a glimmering of …

John: It is like that. It’s like deep space having presence in your mind and then, because it settles in your mind and you’re not going to thought, emotion or feeling, then deep space – which has nothing to do with our experience on this planet with our selves – has presence, slowly, that comes into thought and feeling, will and emotion which is a complete shift of seeing. The seeing doesn’t need to first make sense. It’s first known.

If you’re not drawing conclusions from knowing something so profoundly different that doesn’t yet have a practical application, then it continues to build in your experience. As soon as you draw a conclusion, you end that depth infusion because you’re moving into a practical application. It will become practical without you making it practical. As soon as it becomes practical, you know and then you conclude.

What this shock event really offers is either a strengthening of a self-orientation, because that’s what’s affected, or if you’re gentled and quieted within, this shock event opens up the deep. So what it really addresses, as you’ve remained gentled and quieted in the midst of anything that brings your attention to your self, what this does is it brings up the level of you way, way within that is like deep space being you, that gets to have presence in the midst of this circumstance because that’s how deeply you’re starting to relate within.

The greater the cost, in your experience, of being gentled and quieted, the greater the depth within that you’re relating to. So really, in this kind of event, this kind of shock event, the opportunity for you to realize a depth of being is enormous. It’s a worldwide opportunity to realize something a little bit more that’s really difficult to come by: to realize the truth, within, because of the invitation that’s present within this extreme worldwide event to relate to something that’s other than what affects our selves, other than fear, other than hope, other than survival. There’s the invitation to quietly realize, within, in a way that’s new, and it stands on its own.

Q1: When I touch into that kind of relating, it feels like it’s happening intermittently in the background in me, and that I’m more and more helpless in doing anything to bring it into the foreground.

John: Warmly helpless. It’s the warmth, the quietude in the warmth that shifts the orientation.

Q1: Thank you so much, John.

John: Yes. Bye for now.

Q1: Bye.


John: Hello.

Q2: Hello. I would like to continue a bit about this situation in the world right now and here in Denmark we’re not allowed to go out and it’s like if I understand what you’re saying, it doesn’t matter if I go out or if I stay at home or if I grab a lot of food or if I don’t. That’s just secondary, right?

John: Secondary to what you really are, yes. Living, survival on every level is secondary to what you really are.

Q2: I had a dream about this virus, someone wanting to show me, it was like a cell, there were two parts in it and someone told me that there was someone evil and it wanted to spread it around through the water and I knew that if I just would stay in the heart then nothing could happen to me. Is it like that?

John: There are no evil viruses. Viruses on their own, regardless of how they perform on the surface, are not bad. They are really all right. They can affect your body in a way that’s bad for your physical circumstances. That doesn’t make the virus bad. On a different level, it making it difficult for your body or your whole relationship to survival can seem bad, but as you drop deeper within and you start to realize what you’re not used to realizing normally in your life because you’re not so strongly affected as you are in the circumstance, then this goodness arises.

We are capable of depth perspective, which means that our perspective isn’t governed by our experience, what we feel, what we think. So we are present within thought and feeling, but present in a way that is deeper within than anything to do with our experience. That makes us beingness of depth knowledge in the midst of a worldwide virus takeover.

Q2: But it’s like before the virus it was also like that, right? People were also living in fear or living in this contraction, and now they are shaken because of the shock, so in a way it can be more …

John: It presents everyone with a different kind of opportunity. There’s the invitation to feel differently, to think differently, to open in a way that we’re not familiar with. That’s there for everyone, so regardless of how we’re affected on the surface, in our lives, there’s an unusual opportunity that the whole world is in to see differently, a little differently, instead of being oriented to what we’re used to of gain and loss.

Q2: Thank you.

John: Yes. See you later.

Q2: Yes.

John: Bye.


Q3: I’m calling from Denmark, as you know. It’s also the world situation. What I experience is happening in the collective consciousness, my question is, is it part of this shock event that there’s some sort of a balance in facing the facts, facing what is actually going on, like seeing reality as it is on the actual level, while in the midst of that standing in the vertical? What I experience is that it feels like there can be a tendency to not want to see what is actually going on or what it’s about; what is rolling towards us in the actual level.

John: What’s rolling towards you is that you’re going to die.

Q3: What is that?

John: What is rolling toward you is that you are going to die, eventually.

Q3: Yes.

John: And this event just brings up how much you haven’t been in touch with that.

Q3: Yes.

John: Without this event your death is so far removed from you that it doesn’t have your thoughts. It has your thoughts, and then what comes up in your experience is fear and concern.

Q3: Exactly. It’s moving closer very, very fast, so it’s the realization that a lot of people are going to die.

John: Then this can be the beginning, for you, of you living with your death, whenever it’s going to be, but the subject of your death, the reality of your death, that it has a warm presence in your heart. It really is a warm and a dear part of your whole existence and your whole life, because your existence isn’t going to continue here in physicality. So if you’re living with your death warmly in your heart, your whole seeing, as you live, changes. You’ll think differently, you’ll feel differently. You won’t have a perspective with the underlying belief that your existence is going to continue in physicality. You won’t have the underlying belief that everything needs to go well for you in this life.

You’re grounded in a depth perspective that your death isn’t going to affect, and it’s that level of seeing that becomes freed in your life.

Q3: Are you describing to me now what is actually happening, going to happen, or …?

John: What’s able to happen within you on a heart level.

Q3: I know that, and I know the truth of it and I know that in a situation like this that’s the only way forward because things are going to happen no matter what, anyway.

John: And then a little deeper than that is that it first, first, deeply, warmly, doesn’t matter to you what does or doesn’t happen, just in terms of a profound sense of wellbeing, that that wellbeing, sense of wellbeing in you doesn’t come from your self, doesn’t come from your experiences. It doesn’t come from your physical existence here in this world; it comes from what’s deeper within than your self and you’re consciously, then, being that.

Q3: What I wanted to clear was actually whether this virus is here or not, because a lot of people think it’s not here and a lot of people think it is here, so the question is around seeing the actual reality as it is.

John: The actual reality isn’t first the surface occurrence. The actual reality has to include every level of what there is. Most of the levels are all unseen.

Q3: So when I refer to actual reality, I mean the surface level. I mean people dying and the virus and everything that’s happening with the world, the society breaking down sort of thing.

John: Most of society is artificial. It isn’t based in the real; it’s based on that everything is going to continue. It’s based on what we fear could happen and what we hope will happen.

You being what you are after you’ve died while you live, life is good.

Q3: Yes. I really feel the change in perspective. There’s a change also in what actions to take on the surface.

John: Then you’re more of a being taking action rather than a fearful self taking action.

Q3: Yeah.

John: The fearful self doesn’t function very well. See you out there in all of this connectivity.

Q3: Thank you, John.

John: Bye for now.

Q3: Bye.

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Join the discussion One Comment

  • William Chapman says:

    The Great Revealer of Orientation. Shouted from the rooftops while running to and fro to hide the false assembly of false form and embarrassment of nakedness while the few, that have suffered long, now their blindness healed, sweetly grateful… are lifted up in the midst of the scourge. Like lights leading in the black without ever the need that others should follow. Oil in their lamps. Their bridegroom is calling.

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